Transcript for the Piece Audio version of BOB DYLAN: LIVE AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL
Bob Dylan: Live at Newport
Radio script
Music: Maggie's Farm
Marsh (15:15): what went on in 65, all hashed out, evidence is in and it?s ambiguous, bob must be very happy.
WHETHER IT WAS HIS INTENTION TO OR NOT, BOB DYLAN CREATED A MODERN MYTH IN 1965. ALL HE HAD TO DO WAS PLUG IN AN ELECTRIC GUITAR AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL. TO THIS DAY, NO TWO PEOPLE AGREE ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED.
BUT THAT WAS DYLAN?S THIRD APPEARANCE AT NEWPORT, AND LOOKING BACK AT HIS ARTISTIC PROGRESSION FROM 1963 TO 65 AT LEAST SHOWS US WHERE IT ALL STARTED.
IN THE NEXT HOUR, WE?RE GOING TO HEAR THE STORY FROM GEORGE WEIN, MURRAY LERNER, JOHN COHEN, DAVE MARSH, BILL FLANAGAN AND GREIL MARCUS. AND WE?LL HEAR HIGHLIGHTS FROM DYLAN?S LIVE PERFORMANCES AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL.
I?M RITA HOUSTON, AND WELCOME TO ?BOB DYLAN: LIVE AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL.?
Music fades
THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL BEGAN IN 1959, FOUNDED BY GEORGE WEIN, PETE SEEGER, OSCAR BRAND, THEODORE BIKEL AND ALBERT GROSSMAN, WHO WOULD LATER BE BOB DYLAN MANAGER.
MURRAY LERNER CAPTURED DYLAN?S THREE YEARS AT NEWPORT ON FILM.
ML: [1:18] the Newport Folk Festival started as an offshoot in a way of George Wein?s putting on the Jazz Festival and then he saw that there was room for that, from what I understood, at Newport. It was Joan Baez, I think, who really made it famous. I think in about 1960 or ?59 or ?61, I don?t know, but she?Time Magazine sort of discovered her so to speak and put her?I think she had the cover of Time and was famous for her singing, her beautiful voice. Then I think she brought Dylan to Newport, which of course, increased the interest, but at that time he wasn?t a big star.
GEORGE WEIN HEARD ABOUT DYLAN THROUGH THE GRAPEVINE BEFORE BRINGING HIM ON THE FESTIVAL.
GW [24:17]: If you?d been in The Village at that time or been in Harvard Square at that time, the folk scene was amazing. Joanie Baez was the queen of Harvard Square and Bob Dylan was the king of the village. Joanie preceded Bob by a year or so, maybe I don?t know, one year, two years. Bob Dylan was the best of the lot. There were dozens of kids and young people singing with the guitar and writing music and singing their own songs, and some of them singing traditional songs. Bob was the best, and it was evident that he was the best. So, it was not difficult. The public picks up on things very quickly, and the trade picks up. When a great jazz musician comes along, the other musicians know he?s great and the critics pick up on it; the public doesn?t always pick up on it because it?s not easy to recognize great jazz sometimes, but the critics do and the other musicians do.
Music: Talkin? WW III Blues
?TALKIN? WORLD WAR THREE BLUES? PERFORMED BY BOB DYLAN AT THE 1963 NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL.
THE FESTIVAL RAN FOR SEVERAL DAYS, ALLOWING THE MUSICIANS TO SPEND TIME TOGETHER AWAY FROM THE STAGE.
NEWPORT FOUNDER GEORGE WEIN.
GW [25:25]: That was one of the great nights in history after a festival. We had a beautiful old house up in Newport that we rented that was the headquarters of the festival. Joyce, my wife, and Toshi Seeger arranged the parties. This was something because John Hurt was on the back steps, on the stoop, sitting there playing and singing with ten or twenty kids just sitting there having a memorable moment they?d never forget for their entire life. You had Odetta singing in the living room and people sitting around, you had a bluegrass group out on the lawn on the other side of the house. Dylan and Joan Baez disappeared into a room and were trading songs with each other, and that was their first really close encounter. I guess they had met but it was the first time they had both had their guitars and were trading songs. I stuck my nose in there and then I got out because I didn?t want to disturb them; I should have sat there and listened, it would have been fun but that was?nobody was in it, to my knowledge, there might have been somebody else there, but I wasn?t paying attention to that. But, I remember very well that they were trading songs, what songs they were trading, don?t ask me.
WORKSHOPS DURING THE DAY ALSO BROUGHT THE SINGERS TOGETHER TO TRADE SONGS.
FILMMAKER MURRAY LERNER CREATED THE DOCUMENTARY ?THE OTHER SIDE OF THE MIRROR: BOB DYLAN LIVE AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL 1963 TO 1965.?
ML [11:40]: He began as a callow youth you could almost see that the guitar seemed too big for him to hold if you remember, and then a very talented callow youth and all the singers around him, the folk singers, were listening raptly to him at that time, especially Mountain Iron Ore. I still remember he, it?s a great scene, he didn?t have a pick so one of the folk singers handed him a pick and he was listening quite strongly; Doc Watson was, Judy Collins was more of a commercial singer, but still a folk singer. Then he started to sing, I don?t know what they thought of that, ?God On My Side? which was still a folk tradition, it?s a ballad of sorts as he put it, and his rye way it tells a story if you like stories, but ?With God on my Side? was really a revelation, I thought and it?s still unfortunately very pertinent. As he ends saying, ?I?m thinking that if God was on our side he would stop the next war? its still unfortunately pertinent, and we all know that everybody thinks now that God is on their side.
DYLAN AND JOAN BAEZ TEAMED UP FOR ?WITH GOD ON OUR SIDE.?
Music: With God On Our Side
?WITH GOD ON OUR SIDE? PERFORMED AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL BY BOB DYLAN AND JOAN BAEZ.
I?M RITA HOUSTON, AND YOU?RE LISTENING TO ?BOB DYLAN: LIVE AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL.?
FILMMAKER MURRAY LERNER.
ML: [4:39] Well, Dylan didn?t play time tested old songs, number one. Number two, I don?t?yeah no, number two, he didn?t really play that, he played his own compositions for the most part which were based on some time tested songs at the beginning, but when you say look back, they were trying to look back at their roots which had more integrity and more reality than they thought contemporary commercial music had. So, in a way, it?s rediscovering the authenticity of American life in a way and bringing it to the attention of?what had been lost by culture in a sense that was the counter culture to the day
LIKE MANY FOLK SINGERS, BOB DYLAN ADAPTED MANY OLD MELODIES AND WROTE NEW LYRICS TO THEM. IT?S WHAT PETE SEEGER CALLED ?THE FOLK PROCESS.?
THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL IN 1963 FEATURED THE FREEDOM SINGERS OF THE STUDENT NON-VIOLENT COORDINATING COMMITTEE, OR SNIC FOR SHORT. DYLAN KEPT PRETTY CLOSE TO THEM.
AUTHOR AND CRITIC DAVE MARSH.
Marsh: 63 apogee of original folk revival, snic freedom singers at Newport, civil rights people sang rock too as well as folk classics, Dylan got close to freedom singers, we shall overcome Dylan singing with snic at finale, goal of left wing and civil rights mvmt to grab onto cultural happening and go with it, Dylan not messing with it, singing original lyrics, attached to it at very moment he?s stepping back from it
THE CIVIL RIGHTS AND PROTEST MOVEMENT CONSIDERED DYLAN THEIR GOLDEN BOY, THE FUTURE OF THE CAUSE. HE SANG AT THE MARCH ON WASHINGTON, STANDING AT THE PODIUM NEXT TO REVEREND MARTIN LUTHER KING, JR.
OVER THE NEXT YEAR, DYLAN WOULD ALIENATE HIMSELF FROM THE MOVEMENT. BUT THAT SUMMER IN 1963, HE WAS IN THE THICK OF IT.
FESTIVAL FOUNDER GEORGE WEIN.
GW [16:46]: First of all, civil rights is not necessarily left wing. I don?t think Bob Dylan was ever a left winger, he was concerned with people and humanity. There?s no question that he was a topical songwriter. He wanted to get rid of that mantle of being a topical songwriter. That?not the public didn?t want him to get rid of it; that?s what he was until he went rock and realized he?d better reflect other aspects of life, not just topical political things. But that?s what he was, and most of his songs reflected that. ?The Times They are a Changing?, what do you want more than that? The answer my friend is blowing in the wind. That was all related to civil rights and that was his inspiration. So, to deny that he was that, or to accept that fact that he wanted to change that that?s two different things.
Music: Blowin? in the Wind
?BLOWIN? IN THE WIND? PERFORMED LIVE AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL BY BOB DYLAN WITH THE FREEDOM SINGERS, JOAN BAEZ AND PETER, PAUL AND MARY.
IN A MINUTE, WE?LL HEAR HOW DYLAN RETURNED TO THE FESTIVAL A YEAR LATER WITH A NEW CURVEBALL FOR THE FOLK SCENE TO FIGURE OUT.
I?M RITA HOUSTON, AND YOU?RE LISTENING TO ?BOB DYLAN: LIVE AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL.?
Break 1 with music bed (1:00)
WELCOME BACK TO ?BOB DYLAN: LIVE AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL.? I?M RITA HOUSTON.
FILMMAKER MURRAY LERNER DOCUMENTED THE FESTIVAL.
ML: [7:19] I think there was a lot of controversy about Dylan mainly starting in 1964 and he began to even flourish more with new music and became somewhat of a star. I think there were very mixed opinions about him among the real traditional folk singers and even the board. The board of Newport was made up of performers. It was a nonprofit thing, unlike the jazz festival, made up of performers all of whom got the same exact amount of money; I think it was $50 for an appearance. You know, a lot of people didn?t like the idea of changing the words or of having stars there, and Dylan was becoming a star and Alan Lomax was one of the senior members of the board who, you know powerful members, who was really negative about people like Dylan and I think George Wein liked the whole gamut as he told me the range, and he didn?t want to over emphasize Dylan.
DYLAN GAINED MORE FAME IN THE YEAR BETWEEN FESTIVAL APPEARANCES. IN 1964, HIS ATTITUDE HAD ALSO CHANGED. HE AND JOAN BAEZ WOULD EVEN WALK AROUND THE NEWPORT STREETS, DYLAN CRACKING A BULLWHIP WITH A MISCHEVIOUS SMILE ON HIS FACE.
THE SONGS REFLECTED THE NEW DYLAN AS WELL. AUTHOR DAVE MARSH.
Marsh: photos taken at topical song workshop at 64 newport, meant to be singing protest songs, Dylan brings it ain?t me, babe, protest against protest song, sets people back, not what they wanted to hear, being obstinate, chameleon, changeling imp, moment where it changed, goes from being golden boy to suspect, if they had rendition, they would have sent him to folk music camp for reeducation. Saying me protesting you is a legit protest as well. Baldwin quote, most white people think happy songs should sound happy, sad sad, and god help us that?s how they do it, Dylan crossing that line.
Music: It Ain?t Me Babe
A BIT OF ?IT AIN?T ME, BABE? SUNG BY BOB DYLAN AND JOAN BAEZ AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL.
FILMMAKER MURRAY LERNER SAW THE CHANGE IN DYLAN FROM 1963 TO 64.
ML [12:00]: So, he was part of the whole movement that year, and then I think that changed very strongly the next year in 1964, the great representative of that, representation of that was Tambourine Man, which was really a whole different world of imagery and of ideas?maybe not of ideas that music is enchanting and the pied piper ideas there in Tambourine Man, but still, it was a new way of looking at things and new imagery, and he?obviously that was a commercial hit. He didn?t make it that, I think Peter, Paul, & Mary and The Byrds made it a commercial hit, and it?s a beautiful song, and then he did go on, I think the achievement in the song
Music: Mr. Tambourine Man
?MR. TAMBOURINE MAN,? PERFORMED BY BOB DYLAN AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL.
I?M RITA HOUSTON, AND YOU?RE LISTENING TO ?BOB DYLAN: LIVE AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL.?
?MR. TAMBOURINE MAN? MARKED DYLAN?S NEW WRITING STYLE, WHICH WAS MUCH MORE PERSONAL AND PSYCHEDELIC.
AUTHOR BILL FLANAGAN.
BF: By 1964, Dylan's turned into the bohemian, Verlaine, Rombeau, free associating, streams of imagery writer of "Tambourine Man" which actually hadn't come out yet, and "Chimes of Freedom" and all that kind of stuff, so he's gone from the leftie folky Woodie Guthrie disciple of 63, to being this kind of super hip bohemian left bank kind of poet in 64.
DYLAN MET A LOT OF RESISTANCE FROM THE FOLK ESTABLISHMENT.
BF: Well, you know, obviously there were always a lot of gate keepers and crossing guards patrolling up and down to make sure nobody put a foot wrong or used an augmented chord at these folk festivals, and I guess some of them were probably annoyed, or pretended to be annoyed, or thought they were supposed to be annoyed that Dylan wasn't just singing topical songs out of the newspaper of the day, but there's nothing you can do about people like that. It would be immoral to shoot them and it would be unkind to talk about them.
Music: Chimes of Freedom
?CHIMES OF FREEDOM? SUNG BY BOB DYLAN AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL IN 1964.
MUSIC CRITIC DAVE MARSH.
Marsh (22): choir needs to be preached to as well, but Dylan?s greatest act of leadership was to put down the flag and pick up the electric guitar. Couldn?t carry both.
IN A MINUTE, WE?LL HEAR WHAT MANY CALL ?THE SHOT HEARD AROUND THE WORLD,? THE OPENING HIT OF ?LIKE A ROLLING STONE.?
I?M RITA HOUSTON, AND YOU?RE LISTENING TO ?BOB DYLAN: LIVE AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL.?
Break 2 with music bed (1:00)
WELCOME BACK TO ?BOB DYLAN: LIVE AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL.? I?M RITA HOUSTON.
AUTHOR BILL FLANAGAN.
BF: Well, you know, I think that across the first half of the 60's Dylan was finding new followers all the time, just as he was trying out new things all the time. It wasn't a case where "Free Wheelin Bob Dylan" was a number one album and had four hit singles and therefore he had an audience he had to protect. It was a sequence, a non-stop sequence, of people discovering him and coming to him. So, I think there were people who came to him because he was a so called protest singer and they liked that kind of thing, and there were people who came to him I'm sure because he wrote good love songs like "One Too Many Mornings" and "Don't Think Twice", and people kept coming. People kept coming for "It Ain't Me Babe" and people kept coming for "My Back Pages" and just as they had come for "Blowing in the Wind" and "Times They are a Changing". By the time you get to "Tambourine Man" and "Like a Rolling Stone" you have a massive audience moving toward Dylan that more than makes up for any leftists who were just delusioned and wanted to go back to "Stingin Outside the Prison", which is an honorable undertaking if that's what you want to do. Its not the only thing to do and its certainly not the only obligation music has.
DYLAN?S APPEARANCE AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL IN 1965 RAN THE GAMUT. IN THE AFTERNOON, HE WAS PLAYING ACOUSTIC SONGS AT WORKSHOPS. THE NIGHT PERFORMANCE WOULD BE VERY DIFFERENT.
Music: Maggie?s Farm (under)
SO DYLAN BRINGS OUT THE PAUL BUTTERFIELD BLUES BAND, MINUS PAUL BUTTERFIELD, AND WHAT HAPPENED NEXT ENTERS THE REALM OF MYTHOLOGY.
MURRAY LERNER FILMED THE CONCERT THAT NIGHT, AND YEARS LATER TALKED TO MEMBERS OF THE AUDIENCE ABOUT IT.
ML [23]: One person got up and said I was sitting in the front of the stage and the only boos were from the performers backstage. So, I said I don?t think so, first of all, I don?t think the performers would boo, there?s no way that Pete Seeger would boo at Dylan, and Peter Yarrow was backstage and Joan Baez, they weren?t going to boo. I said I don?t think that?s true whatsoever. He said ?No, no, I was there and I heard it.? Okay, another guy gets up and says well I was there in a similar?in front of the stage, near the front, and it was the press that was booing from the press section and from the performers underneath the stage. I said there were no?nobody was underneath the stage as I remember?maybe, but it didn?t sound?then a third person got up and said ?I was there, and in the audience, and the audience was booing, and I didn?t hear much, if anything from the stage?. So it was very interesting about this memory thing, I was so glad that happened. I thought I was sunk with the second one, but the third one got up and that?s what I think is the truth. But who knows, you don?t know what truth is, on that level.
ANOTHER LEGEND FROM THAT NIGHT INVOLVED PETE SEEGER THREATENING TO CUT THE POWER WITH AN AXE.
FESTIVAL FOUNDER GEORGE WEIN.
GW [7:00]: I?ve been reading about it in so many different places, and there are different versions of the story. Most of them are fairly accurate except the one about Pete Seeger with the axe, I mean that was ridiculous. Nobody was concerned with it. People came to me, some of my staff came and said you better go back and see Pete he?s upset. Pete was sitting in a car, he had run away the sound was so loud. I remember we did not have a sounds system set up for that type of electronic music. It was more than electric guitar we?d been having electric guitars at jazz festivals for years, this was a different kind of?this was rock guitars, and with?getting the sound as loud as possible thorough a system that was not equipped to handle that kind of sound. So, Pete was in the car and he said, can you do something?you gotta do something about that sound. I said, Pete it?s too late, we can?t do anything.
PHOTOGRAPHER, FILM MAKER AND MEMBER OF THE NEW LOST CITY RAMBLERS JOHN COHEN KNEW DYLAN FROM THE EARLY DAYS.
Cohen: later that evening, after my wife and daughter had gone to sleep, I went off to a party and Bob was the only one there. It was the beginning of the party. It was Bob and myself talked a little bit, quietly talking about what went wrong. He said, ?What happened, what happened?? He was pretty shook up and we started to talk, but then the press and all the other performers came. And they all ganged up on him. And I left and that was the end of that. But in retrospect, he and many other singers were feeling the influence of the Beatles who had just really hit hard the year before in ?64. The arrival of rock and roll and the Beatles kind of knocked out the Kingston Trio and The Limelighters and all that forever. And that was good. It didn?t bother us because we, The New All City Ramblers, we were totally into our own message and our own music. And then these other guys were taking blues and electric instruments and putting it out there. That?s what Bob did that night, coupled with his incredible ability to write songs that caught the atmosphere, and used the language of the time, and used the language of traditional music as well. So that was good. As to whether it?s a turning point in the twentieth century, that?s for someone else to think about.
Music: Like A Rolling Stone
?LIKE A ROLLING STONE? PERFORMED BY BOB DYLAN WITH HIS ELECTRIC BAND AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL IN 1965.
I?M RITA HOUSTON, AND YOU?RE LISTENING TO ?BOB DYLAN: LIVE AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL.?
AND NOW, THE AFTERMATH. WE BEGIN WITH MUSIC CRITIC AND AUTHOR GREIL MARCUS.
GREIL MARCUS: From the time that Bob Dylan appeared at the Newport Folk Festival in 1965, when he first appeared with a band, playing electric instruments, first time since high school anyway, and there was great outrage, and there was booing. There was anger, there was fury, there was applause, there was stunned silence, but there was a great sense of betrayal. As if something precious and delicate was being dashed to the ground and stomped. As if the delicate flower of folk music, the priceless heritage of impoverished black farmers and destitute white miners, was being mocked by a dandy, with a garish noisy electric guitar, who was going to make huge amounts of money as a pop star by exploiting what he found from these poor people. That?s a very crude, but I don?t think all together inaccurate summation of something very complex. In which, at the time for many years, I didn?t have a clue about.
WRITER AND CRITIC DAVE MARSH.
Marsh (17): what doesn?t get talked about is that he took everyone with him. All young singers within a year made their electric albums, more personal songs, openly blues influenced
AUTHOR BILL FLANAGAN.
BF: Well, the 65 show has kind of gone down as the?in England they think that that's when rock was invented, but of course in England they don?t seem to?they seem to have a very much stricter definition of rock than the rest of us do. The 65 show is when the energy and excitement and kind of teen spirit of The Beatles and the English bands and everything that was going on with the British Invasion came together with the seriousness of intent of folk music and the idea that lyrics would really be about something. And, also, it has to be said, what Dylan was really doing there was sort of putting the Muddy Waters electric blues band into a folk lyric, if you want to call it that, and rock and roll pop context. So, he was bringing together a lot of different streams there and nothing was the same after that. I mean, even Rolling Stones songs like "19th Nervous Breakdown" and things like that really seemed to come out of that moment when Dylan went electric, as do a lot of the things that The Beatles started doing. They started getting a little more serious in their lyrics and doing it quickly, so it is the moment when these different streams; kind of the leftist protest movement, the civil rights movement, and rock and roll, pop music, British Invasion, you know, skinny guys in cool suits with electric guitars all start to converge, and then that stays tangled up for 20 years. I mean that stays tangled up through Jimi Hendrix, through David Bowie, through Bruce Springsteen, right up to Prince and U2. That stays tangled up.
THAT NIGHT AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL, THE CROWD DEMANDED MORE DYLAN. MURRAY LERNER WAS THERE FILMING THE WHOLE THING.
ML [18:00]: .Peter Yarrow who was the master of ceremonies at that time asked the crowd do you want him back, and of course the crowd said yes, and then he said he has to get an acoustic guitar, and then he sang?we have that fabulous moment in it where he says ?Has anybody got an E harmonica? he forgot his harmonica. He says, ?Throw them all up? and of course, lots of them land on the stage and he takes one and plays with it. I don?t think he?d do that now necessarily, but?and sings Tambourine Man again. I think it was a slightly different version, and you see him sweating by the way, he was tense. Some people thought he was crying, but he wasn?t, there were drops of water on his face you know, and tense. Then he ends and he does a good harmonica solo, so it?s a good thing he had that harmonica. Then he does?the last song he did was ?Its All Over Now Baby Blue? which is kind of a good image of the end, and the audience went wild applauding, of course, and he left the stage and that was the end of his stay at Newport and the beginning of a new kind of music, I think, in America?at least.
Music: It?s All Over Now, Baby Blue
?IT?S ALL OVER NOW, BABY BLUE? PERFORMED BY BOB DYLAN AT THE 1965 NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL.
LET?S GIVE THE LAST WORD TO DYLAN, HERE AT A SAN FRANCISCO PRESS CONFERENCE A FEW MONTHS AFTER HIS ELECTRIC DEBUT.
Dylan: well, I did a crazy thing?
?BOB DYLAN: LIVE AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL? WAS PRODUCED BY JOYRIDE MEDIA. PAUL CHUFFO AND JOSHUA JACKSON ARE THE PRODUCERS.
OUR EXECUTIVE PRODUCER IS JOHN VERNILE
ALL SONGS ON THIS PROGRAM CAN BE FOUND ON THE COLUMBIA/ LEGACY DVD RELEASE ?THE OTHER SIDE OF THE MIRROR: BOB DYLAN LIVE AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL 1963-1965,? AN MLF PRODUCTIONS FILM.
SPECIAL THANKS GO TO ADAM BLOCK, STEVE BERKOWITZ, JEFF ROSEN, APRIL HAYES, MURRAY LERNER, ANDY CAHN, ERIC MOLK, SHANNON MUELLER, NADINE NASSAR, MICHELLE CLARK, SIMON RENTNER AND WILLS GLASSPIEGEL.
I?M RITA HOUSTON, AND THANKS FOR LISTENING.
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I?M RITA HOUSTON. JOIN ME FOR AN HOUR OF HIGHLIGHTS FROM BOB DYLAN?S LIVE PERFORMANCES AT THE NEWPORT FOLK FESTIVAL.
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